Best practice forum (Archived)

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Thursday, 13 December 2012, 2:25 AM
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Re: Audience program unenrollment
by ? ? - Thursday, 13 December 2012, 4:33 AM
 

Hi Darren,

I did not realise this happened and would not have assumed this! If the above is correct, this could potentially cause massive problems for clients.

If completion data is wiped if they leave a dynamic audience then that makes no sense what-so-ever. They will need to keep their records of learning.

Many people have audiences based on location, so they can enrol departments/areas onto courses. If a person was to move, all their records of learning would be los? If so thats not great!

Can this be addressed?

Cheers,

Joe

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Thursday, 13 December 2012, 5:57 AM
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Thursday, 13 December 2012, 6:15 AM
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Kathie Robeson
Re: Audience program unenrollment
by Kathie Robeson - Thursday, 13 December 2012, 6:37 AM
 
Interesting.  I would expect the completion data to persist in the user record, even if it is not displayed.  I don't think either Moodle or Totara is designed to 'erase' it.  Still of concern is that unenrollment behavior takes place - and that this may impact what the learner may see and be able to document in terms of completions.  Wondering now - if the learner is unenrolled upon removal from a dynamic Audience, do the Completion Reports stay accurate anyway?
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Thursday, 13 December 2012, 8:53 AM
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Re: Audience program unenrollment
by ? ? - Thursday, 13 December 2012, 4:11 PM
 

But this is how Course Enrolments have always worked in 2.2.

In 2.2 users can be enroled on a course under any number of enrolment methods - manual, self-enrolment, program, plan, guest, LDAP...in fact there are 14 different enrolment plugin types currently in 2.2 which can be enabled on particular courses. A user needs to be enroled on a course under any one enrolment plugin to gain access.

In this case the user had access via the program, which was lost when they were unassigned from the program. And if they were not also assigned to the course under some other method (manial, self enrolment etc) then they were no longer enroled in the course.The fact that they used to be enroled and had completed the course in the past is of no importance in the Moodle 2.2 enrolment model - they don't have access under any existing enrolment method any more.

Once re-added to the Audience, they were re-added to the program and gained access to the course through the Program Enrolment, and the system let them know that this was the case.

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Friday, 14 December 2012, 2:22 AM
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Re: Audience program unenrollment
by ? ? - Friday, 14 December 2012, 3:06 AM
 

> I have all courses set with "Completion tracking begins on enrolment", and if programs do do course enrollment then I would expect to see those courses appear in their Course Completion block when they are enrolled on the program. At the moment they only show when they access the course for the first time from the program in their Required Learning page.

As I understand it, a Program is a method of Enrolment. When a user enters a course the system checks for enrolment methods; and in the case of a course in a program to which they are assigned, the program does the enrolment silently. Now, on enrolment, Completion Tracking begins and the course appears in the Course Completion block etc. 
Completion tracking begins on enrolment which in the case of a course in a program begins on entry to the course, not before then.
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Friday, 14 December 2012, 4:11 AM
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Re: Audience program unenrollment
by ? ? - Thursday, 13 December 2012, 4:10 PM
 

First of all can I make it clear that no completion data is ever wiped.

Secondly, if audience start and end dates are set then the audience cron does not add or remove audience members if the audience is inactive.

Thirdly, on program enrolments this is the way dynamic audiences was designed and is the expected behaviour in many cases - for example consider a dynamic audience based on location or position, where people in that location or position have a required program of learning.

If the learner moves from that location or position, then the program associated with that location or position is (usually) no longer relevant to the learner and so they should be unenrolled from it and it should no longer be required learning. Though any courses they completed while part of the program should still be in their completion record.

I can see the case however that in certain circumstances you might want Audience Program Enrolments to be "sticky" so that once you were ever in an audience then you get the program which always remains required learning even after you have left the audience. It's something we'll have to think about in case it has knock-on effects elsewhere but I can see how it might be useful. However often the same effect can be obtained by re-thinking the dynamic audience rules.

With the existing functionality, in your particular case you want all new hires to have a required induction program which always remains in their required learning. This could be accomplished by creating an audience, with an attached program, where the start date is after whatever date the induction program came into effect. If the induction program changes every year, then two rules - start date after 01/01/2012 and start date before 31/12/2012. The program would be assigned to this audience.

If you also want a quick way to just list this week's new hires, then have a second audience which is users with a start date in the last 7 days, with no attached enrolled program.

Hope this helps

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Friday, 14 December 2012, 1:50 AM
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Monday, 17 December 2012, 12:38 PM
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me
Re: Audience program unenrollment
by George Angus - Monday, 17 December 2012, 12:52 PM
Group Totara

Hi Niek,

Ciaran is off on holiday until after New Year, but what you are saying is right - you can add users anytime before the start of the program, but they will not be invited to enrol until the start date, and will be unenrolled at the end.

hope this is useful,

George.